Your thoughts on burying pots

largosmom · Post by **largosmom** » Jan 16, 2008 9:40 pm

Hi, I am planning my newest garden bed for next spring, and it's going to primarily be for the hostas. I have a big problem with voles and will start leaving them some treats in the next week in preparation. I want to put a barrier in for the hostas, and am considering purchasing some larger sized nursery pots and cutting the bottoms out and using those to protect the hostas.

I would appreciate your thoughts on pros and cons of doing this. My intent is to use a "lasagna bed" method for the soil, and I'll use the same soil inside the pot as outside.

DBoweMD · Post by **DBoweMD** » Jan 17, 2008 9:24 am

It works well if the pot is big enough. You don't have to cut the bottoms out if it already has drain holes.

Post by **Chris_W** » Jan 17, 2008 11:44 am

Hi Laura,

I'm curious to know how the pots would actually keep out any voles? When we've had vole problems in the past they devastated the potted plants in our cold frames. Sometimes they would chew their way in through the drain holes but often times you could see where they were eating crowns right on the surface. There were also times where they seemed to feast on the plastic instead.

In the garden where I've seen problems they were eating from ground level down. So I don't know how a pot would keep a mouse or vole from chewing up a hosta.

Linda P · Post by **Linda P** » Jan 17, 2008 12:13 pm

Laura, I've also had voles eat hostas in pots. I'm not sure if there is any way to keep them out, other than to be on the ball with bait and trying to keep the numbers down. As this is a new bed, you could mix some grit in the soil when you plant it, and scatter it on top. I know that the voles here love to have some loose stuff to run through and hide in, so I'd be a little worried about them viewing your lasagne bed as a new playground. Chicken wire or hardware cloth cages around the root ball are something that I've heard of but haven't tried. I try to keep a few bait stations out, though I do hate to use poison. I like to use the bait chunks, so that the little varmints have to eat it in the bait station and can't carry it away to hide in other parts of the garden. My cats catch and kill voles, but don't seem to eat them. I asked my sis, who is a vet tech, if there was any worry about the cats eating the poisoned voles. She asked her vet, and he said that they would have to eat several, and the chances of them getting the vole and eating it after it was poisoned and before it died was rather low. I still am not really enthused about using the poison, worrying about predators who might eat a posioned vole. But then, I have yet to see a vole caught by a hawk in my yard, and the owls seem to stick to the barnyard area. My dad used mouse traps for years, with some success, but you have to check them every day and reset them.
I know I've heard people discuss planting hostas in large pots, leaving the top 2 inches or so out of the ground, but I don't know if that really works or not. Voles can climb!
Bare soil around the hostas seems to be less inviting to voles, as they like nothing better than someplace to hide.
Anyway, good luck with the new bed, and be sure to let us know what you decide to do and how it works for you.
Linda P

largosmom · Post by **largosmom** » Jan 17, 2008 8:28 pm

I'm considering most anything that will help! Cages and pots around the plants seem to be about the same in terms of the level of protection they could afford in my mind. Pots seemed cheaper and easier to make. The only "grit" I've been able to find around here is crushed oyster shells. Our soil is fairly acidic, favorable to azaleas, camellias and the like. I could use grit, but my fear is to make the soil too alkaline. The expanded shale products are so expensive for a hobbyist looking for large beds. I used a bag or two for bulbs, but it's just too much.

I've got one neighborhood cat who comes around, but haven't seen him with any catches yet. I usually poke the poison down into their entry holes, so it's not above the soil line for other critters. I've even considered putting up an owl box to try and get some natural control help.

If there is some other reasonably priced "gravel" type of product, I'd love to hear about it. I don't know what to ask for or have delivered.

Laura

eastwood2007 · Post by **eastwood2007** » Jan 18, 2008 12:40 am

It seems I read somewhere that someone mixes pea gravel in the soil....

largosmom · Post by **largosmom** » Jan 18, 2008 10:05 pm

Would like to hear more about that. The "permatil" or "vole bloc" like products advertise that their sharp edges are what deters the voles. I wonder if it's just the gravel altogether.

Maybe I'll try a couple of different products in a couple of different spots. I have a bed that I dug all the hostas out of due to voles and that would be a good spot to start. That one is getting redone in the spring in addition to completing a new bed in the back yard.

I could try pea gravel in one, and crushed gravel in another, or maybe the oyster shell "grit" and see what happens.

Laura

jody · Post by **jody** » Jan 19, 2008 7:43 am

Voles!!!

I battled them for years in MD. They will chew through plastic pots above or below ground. We even had owls nested and an outdoor cat! They just couldn't keep up with the vole population.

I ended up planting any new hosta (I was not going to dig up a couple hundred hosta!!!!) in wire baskets. I bought chicken wire and made sort of "cones" out of them sized the diameter according to the hosta that was going in it. It works well, the voles can only get to any roots that happen to grow out of the wire, never the crown or the marjority of the roots. Time consuming and work but well worth it in the end.

Oh, and palce the wire basket at least an inch or two inches above the soil level, it's easily hiddin with mulch and they never climbed over the top of mine that way.

Then I started baiting them. I used plain old mouse traps baited with granny smith apple pieces. (After trying pbutter and many other recommended foods, the gs apples worked best in my yard) I set about 6-8 traps daily, placed at the entrance/exits holes with a wighted pot on top so other critters wouldn't get into them. Would check them everyday, sometimes a couple of times a day and dispose and rebait as needed. I caught dozens the first couple of weeks then it slowed down to a few here and there.

Then we had the flood from hurricane isabel and I haven't had a vole since

I do have moles back though so I'm sure it's just a matter of time. But it's been since 9/03 with no voles and feels like heaven!

Fortunately I have't seen any in VA yet... I say yet because there are moles here and eventually I'm sure the voles will move in. They often just move into existing mole runs. I'l be ready for them though

jody · Post by **jody** » Jan 19, 2008 8:06 am

And here is a cute but kind of gross pic of one of the owls meals

Although I think this one was a mole not vole

largosmom · Post by **largosmom** » Jan 19, 2008 10:49 am

Jody, how high did you have to hang the house?

Spider · Post by **Spider** » Jan 19, 2008 8:18 pm

is that a short eared or a screech?

Roxanne · Post by **Roxanne** » Jan 19, 2008 11:57 pm

Jody, that is a really cool picture!

It almost makes me think of a cat that kills the mouse and shows it to you with pride.
Did you say "good owl"?? and give him a pet?

jody · Post by **jody** » Jan 20, 2008 6:58 am

Laura I'm not sure what the height on that box was... the owls were in an old flicker hole in an almost dead tree. We put this box up when we finally had to cut the tree down and they moved right in. I'll ask DH. All I know is there is no way I could reach it

Spider they are eastern screech.

Thanks Roxanne! Oh yes, I praised them daily

I was surprised when I went out that morning to see something up there and it took the camera zooming in to see what it was.

largosmom · Post by **largosmom** » Jan 20, 2008 9:39 pm

Jody, do you still get song birds? I'm considering hanging a house in the backyard. My feeders are up front. The gent at the wild bird store where I get my birdseed suggested I would lose the songbirds if I invite an owl in.

Laura

jody · Post by **jody** » Jan 21, 2008 7:48 am

There are still bird nests in the yard... but I stopped feeding them years ago when our stray cat (she's been here 10 yrs now) showed up. She is an outdoor cat and kills everything, birds, bunnies, mice etc etc.

I do feed the birds here in VA though and we have screech owls in the tree by the new house. Owls are nocturnal by nature and hunt only at night so I wouldn't think they would be an issue for most birds. We watch them all the time and they never leave that box until dusk. Sometimes they will sit in the opening of it all day long but they never leave it during the day.

We've got hawks at both places that also prey on the songbirds. I would think they would be worse on birds than owls.

largosmom · Post by **largosmom** » Jan 21, 2008 9:50 pm

Thanks, if I can figure out a way to hang a nest box high enough, I may give it a go. Certainly it couldn't but help with the voles that are out at night. I can handle the ladder for about 8-10 feet up, more than that and I get nervous, but if it's well supported, I could go up a bit higher.

Laura

jody · Post by **jody** » Jan 24, 2008 8:01 am

Laura
DH says the box is about 20' high.

When we decided to build it we had looked up the dimensions on line, so I'm sure you could do the same and get lots of usefull info.

MollyD · Post by **MollyD** » Jan 24, 2008 4:03 pm

Jody if you are seeing moles you need to treat your ground for grubs. That's what attracts the moles.

MollyD