A puzzle for you!

[ViolaAnn]

I've been watching two hostas in my yard. One I've had for a decade, the other only for 3 years. VERY, very similar - similar colouring, size and vein count. BTW, they are quite large - 8" wide at the widest point and 9 1/2"-10" long.

Before I tell you, see if you can guess what they are and whether they are related in some way.

[ViolaAnn]

They don't look quite as similar the way the picture posted on MY screen as they really are.

[ViolaAnn]

Here are pics of the individual plants

the one on the left

the one on the right

[Mark Raw]

Great expectations and maybe Thunderbolt or Dream weaver (to me both same plant)

[paul_in_mn]

Brother Stefan and Great X

[ViolaAnn]

Paul's got the two plants. But which is which?

[Mark Raw]

Left GE right well hmmmm hahahaha

[paul_in_mn]

Left Brother Stefan
Right GE

[ogrefcf]

Left BS
Right GE

[ViolaAnn]

You've got it. BS seems to me, a bit more seer-suckered and seems to have a bit more yellow, but my GE doesn't get as much light. I have been struck by the similarity this year as BS grew. BTW, it's growing much more rapidly than GE which I've had for over a decade.

Both eventually go back to sieboldiana 'Elegans'.

Brother Stefan is 'King Tut' x (x 'Mildred Seaver')
'King Tut' is a 'Tokudama Aureonebulosa' hybrid 'Breeder's Choice' x 'Frances Williams'

'Mildred Seaver' is a hybrid - 'Breeder's Choice' x 'Frances Williams'

'Breeder's Choice' is a hybrid ('Beatrice' x 'Beatrice') x 'Frances Williams'

'Frances Williams' is a sieboldiana 'Elegans' seedling.

Great Expectations is a sieboldiana 'Elegans' sport or hybrid

Some definite family traits showing there.

[Linda P]

Chiming in a little late here, but another one that could be thrown into this comparison is Super Nova....
which is a sport of Aurora Borealis, which is a sport of sieblodiana Elegans...

[ViolaAnn]

Would be interesting to do a pictorial comparison of lots of sieboldiana Elegans family - sports and seedlings.

You'll find a list of sports (46 of them) at http://myhostas.be/sports/index.htm# - scroll down to find it.

Then for progeny in general, there's a LOOOONG list at: http://myhostas.be/db/hostas/sieboldiana+%27Elegans%27

[Chris_W]

When I saw the initial picture I thought Paradigm and Great Expectations. Then when I saw the clumps I immediately changed my mind to Brother Stefan and Great Expectations. That is really interesting that they are definitely cousins, but other than that I think they are very different - especially considering I can't grow Great Expectations to save my soul

Fantastic looking clumps you have there. You certainly grow a lot of beautiful plants

Chris

[ViolaAnn]

of course those of you who guessed, did you let the mouse hover so that you saw the name of the image? Should have changed the names of the two images uploaded.

[Chris_W]

Nope, didn't cheat - and didn't even scroll down to see other guesses

[ogrefcf]

Guessed BS. GE I had no clue on. Had to use Paul for help on that one.

[Angel3K]

Very interesting puzzle Ann. You have lots of great hostas.

I wonder if you have some more look alike..

I am staring at Halcyon and Canadian Blue, both in pots. There is no difference at all, at least now for these smaller plants. I wonder if anyone has bigger clumps of Halcyon and Canadian blue...and make an interesting puzzle too.

[ViolaAnn]

There are a lot of Tardiana blue hostas and blue hostas which are descended from them and I think most people would be hard pressed to tell them apart for sure. I have 'Halcyon' and 'Full Moon', both planted around my 'Regal Splendor' and I know which is which from knowing where they were planted, but from pics, I have to think about it. I guess I should look up the family tree of 'Full Moon' someday.

[ViolaAnn]

Done. 'Full Moon' is a seedling of 'Blue Moon' x 'Blue Moon'.
BM is a seedling - tardiflora x sieboldiana 'Elegans' So here we are - it's another cousin of the hostas under discussion above, but it also has the tardiflora.

Eric Smith hybridized and catagorized his hostas with a series of identifying numbers in the "group" of unlikely cross between H.'Tardiflora' and H.sieboldiana 'Elegans'. Added to his "group" were those from Germany through Heinz Kloze. The named cultivar's started with TF 2 X 4.

http://www.hostasdirect.com/tardiana/

Finally found something but is there ever a lot of garbage listed on the Internet under tardiana ...

Given that Halcyon is part of this group and the number of offspring from Halcyon - June and many others, I think a very large proportion of our favourite hostas share some of this heritage. And good heritage it is too. These are the hostas that survive in my garden all summer long with a minimum of slug and earwig damage.